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Author Topic: Pricing  (Read 16068 times)

Adam Frisch

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #30 on: September 03, 2017, 05:10:37 pm »
Don't mind the interior that much, but the carbon fibre refreshment centers - ugh. Seems otherwise to be a very nice plane.
Slumming it in the turboprop world - so you don't have to.

JMA

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #31 on: January 25, 2018, 09:39:58 am »
Bruce- been out there for a bit now, no bites?  Other than putting in G600, anything missing on it?

https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/20609597/1980-commander-980

donv

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #32 on: January 25, 2018, 12:13:38 pm »
Price was lowered from $895k, wasn't it?

Adam Frisch

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #33 on: January 25, 2018, 05:01:11 pm »
This thing has pretty much everything I want. Schiff ACM, LR tanks etc. But right now I just can't financially.
Slumming it in the turboprop world - so you don't have to.

Bruce Byerly

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #34 on: January 25, 2018, 05:57:21 pm »
Bruce- been out there for a bit now, no bites?  Other than putting in G600, anything missing on it?

https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/20609597/1980-commander-980

Nice plane.  I expect it to sell given the interest levels. Frankly would have sold this week for sure but the pilot preferrred the stock environmental system.

Bruce Byerly

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #35 on: January 25, 2018, 05:59:10 pm »
Price was lowered from $895k, wasn't it?

Yes. $795!

Bruce Byerly

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #36 on: January 25, 2018, 06:05:49 pm »
This thing has pretty much everything I want. Schiff ACM, LR tanks etc. But right now I just can't financially.

Adam; what kind of payments are you looking for?   :D ;D

donv

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #37 on: January 25, 2018, 06:26:39 pm »
Another Sundstrand fan out there?


Nice plane.  I expect it to sell given the interest levels. Frankly would have sold this week for sure but the pilot preferrred the stock environmental system.

donv

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #38 on: January 26, 2018, 01:21:56 am »
It does seem like prices have come down a bit on Commanders, or on Jetprops at least...

Adam Frisch

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #39 on: January 26, 2018, 04:10:46 am »
Adam; what kind of payments are you looking for?   :D ;D

I would like to be able to own any plane I buy outright, but have thought about financing as well. But that's a whole other ball of wax. Maybe for another thread, but here's the reality of financing:

Spoken to a few lenders in the past. Dorr, Air1st, AOPA and a few others when I was looking years back. Dorr was the most responsive, but after awhile it was clear that most aircraft lenders you see are only brokers - so is Dorr. Very few of them actually carry your loan. They're selling them on as soon as they're approved, and therefore they need to be conforming loans. So the only thing you're going to get out of brokers are vanilla loans. What I mean by that is they'll look at your tax return and cash flow and that's it. They don't care if you own real estate outright, if you are multimillionaire in assets, or if you own an aircraft, care very little if your company is profitable etc. They only care about your personal 1040's. And you will have to personally guarantee the loan, even if your corp buys the plane. If you want someone to see the bigger picture, or take other assets into account, you need to find a bank that actually carries the loan themselves. Bank of Montana is one such, but there are a few others.

Again, just an exercise in calculation: to be able to fit a $795K (let's say with 20% down) plane on your 1040, with a debt-to-income ratio of max 40% (which is where they max out), you're looking at an income of about $200K if you have no other loans whatsoever. Most of us have a house payment and a car payment on top of that, so in reality are looking at $400-500K/year on your 1040. I don't know about other self employed people, but very few people I know pull that kind of money out on paper, even the really successful ones. The ones I know find ways to keep that in the company and not tax it all away. 

Maybe the bigger corporations have access to capital etc that I don't know about. But all the lenders I spoke to want max 40% DTI ratio and to personally guarantee the loan (even if your corporation buys the plane). Feels to me that if you can pull out $500K on paper on your tax return, you can probably also afford to pay $795K in cash. So not sure who these airplane loans are made for or who actually gets them...

So, only thing left to hope for is my Bitcoins to shoot through the roof!  ;)
« Last Edit: January 26, 2018, 04:19:49 am by Adam Frisch »
Slumming it in the turboprop world - so you don't have to.

donv

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #40 on: January 26, 2018, 11:25:31 am »
Hopefully you bought your bitcoins a few years back... in which case, go for Bruce's 1000!

Don't forget that your 680 is worth something as a trade-in, especially given all the work you've done.

Steve binnette

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #41 on: January 27, 2018, 10:37:23 am »
It does seem like prices have come down a bit on Commanders, or on Jetprops at least...

I agree it is a good time to buy a jet prop.  About a year ago there was more on the market than I have ever seen.

Slowly the number of jet props for sale on the internet have come back to normal.  Maybe that bunch from a year ago caused some pressure on pricing.

Go for it Adam! Maybe the owner will carry some of the loan?

donv

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #42 on: January 30, 2018, 04:30:22 pm »
I see the 980 is gone from Controller... another potential new member, maybe?

Steve binnette

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #43 on: February 01, 2018, 10:28:10 pm »
Somebody got a good deal!  That plane looked nice.

Adam Frisch

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Re: Pricing
« Reply #44 on: May 14, 2018, 11:51:55 pm »
Seems like the Turbo Commander prices have crept up quite a bit. Is this reflected in real sales prices, or just wishful listings? I just saw a $1mill 840. Very nice, with -10's, but still a high time 840 with old avionics.... ::)
Slumming it in the turboprop world - so you don't have to.